Yes Wes, it is by a handful. The knowledge I have is that in the past an so far, the present, violence stays within the local community and is generally a result of old beefs, gang spats and drugs. Every few years or so, some loner(s) will get the gaul to assault a tourist even to the point of murder, but it is not a common thing. Please forgive my lack of proper recollection, but I do not recall a tourist killing in recent years or any frequency that would lead one to believe that such things are a severe problem. Even In Jamaica you don't hear about such things at an alarming rate. PLEASE I am not trying to trivialize of belittle this. There is hardly a justification to kill ANYONE, much less innocent people trying to enjoy themselves or going about their lives trying to make a living! I only wanted to point out that our islands are not places where tourists are being killed at high rates for those who might not be too up on events in the islands and will go STRICTLY on rumors or misinformation, but regardless, I can understand their concern.

That being said, one has to only figure it is only a matter of time, however, because the bigger problem appears to be the rash of robberies and burglaries on St. Thomas which are NOT restricted to just local residents. Now, while I have yet to hear of any that have resulted in the deaths of any tourists (within the past few years), you figure that with this boldness these boys are showing, it will not be long before they take the next step, but here's the irony. If the local enforcement agency is going to do nothing (as it so appears), why would any of these idiotic thugs need to kill victims/witnesses?

Again, I want to reiterate that I did not make this post to trivialize ANY murder. Only wanted to point out that tourists are not dropping like flies lest this gets lost in all the panic, but I want to reiterate again also, because this might not be the case, tourists, as well as locals, need to still be vigilant and exercise common sense and I cannot stress this enough. No need to leave a backstreet club to walk back to your hotel room well across town. Many of the robberies are probably opportunistic so do not be a help to the situation by leaving bags in hotel rooms with unlocked doors or leave them exposed on ground floors where people can pass by and make assessments which reminds me of my days as a young teenager working at Watergate Villas next to Bolongo Bay. They hired local boys like us to clean the windows from the outside (this was 20 plus years ago) and many tourists used to leave their doors opened. I don't recall any of us ever taking money or jewelry, but we did raid a refrigerator or two. In fact, the younger boys behind me after I left for the states started to actually steal tourists rentals and go on joy rides. This confirms what Bluwater has stated in that such things are not necessarily new, just getting more exposure and should I add, more brazeness.

Did you all read that they went through with the wedding....on STT? I suppose the island will be bittersweet, given that they're going through with the wedding (over by now) plans - getting married on STT.

I think it's very distasteful and disrespectful to be slandering the character of victims of crime with no concrete evidence, particularly victims of homicide. They no longer are able to defend themselves against slanderous speculation by casual observers. I'm always appalled when people seek to put blame on victims.

Most of us have opinions about stuff, but often it's best to keep our opinions to ourselves. Certainly not to get rumors started by posting things on a public forum that cast people in a negative light. People that we don't know or know anything about. All we know is that these guys were found shot to death on a street. All this other stuff is just fiction created in people's imaginations. And it suggests unflattering things about victims of a crime, like somehow they were up to no good and played a part in bringing this on themselves. It's a disrespectful way to treat victims, particularly those who no longer have a voice.

Not only did the wedding take place, but some of the wedding party were in Frenchtown, with police protection, partying that evening. Pretty strange, huh? I think I would be home grieving.

RL

This is such a sad, mysterious, tragic thing. I hope the VIPD can piece the story together and figure it out. Condolences to the family & friends.

--Islander

Where is a "safe" place? If 9-11 did not ram home the idea that you may be killed anywhere, I don't know what will.

Everyone will have an opinion on a subject and I too noticed the place and time and wondered why they were in that area. Having said that, no one should be gunned down at any time or any location. My mom used to say everything is within walking distance if you had the time. Bunker Hill hotel is in the opposite direction and one look around would tell you that you were not in a bustling NYC place. I have heard locals suggesting that they must have followed someone to that location and that person or persons killed them. Or that someone was sent from NYC to do the killing because it is known the the police department in STT is corrupt and incompetent.

Pick your theory... I don't believe we have all the facts yet, let's wait and see what develops.

If it was their first visit to the island, how would they know what areas to avoid? I visit STJ several times a year, and I have NO idea what areas to avoid over on STT, and just rely on locals for information about that. I'm just wondering, not saying that anyone is wrong or right. I just read an article about those two guys and it said that their parents from from the caribbean, but both grew up in NY and niether had been to the island before...kinda scary. I hope something gets done becuase I love the VI and I would hate for crime to get worse or for the tourism trade to suffer.

I've been following this thread for awhile now and I think the thing that jumps out at me is that 2 black guys from NYC out at 2:30 AM are assumed to be 'up to something" or "drugs are invloved" while no one says - "What was a 17 year old girl doing in a club in Aruba at 2AM and leaving that club alone? And what were her parents and the school thinking trurning poorly supervised recent grads loose in Aruba?" No presumption of guilt, just the "OMG, isn't that awful! That poor girl!" Nothing but horror and sorrow for the girl. Nothing but instant speculation about something 'wrong' for the guys - all of 7-8 years older. Two tragedies, two very different reactions - and no solid facts for either. HUMMMM

Early-

I, on another message board, said just that about the Aruba girl. Everyone was up in arms about Aruba and how dangerous it is for kids to take trips. HELLO - She left a nightclub with a car full of guys she didn't know - at 2am - to go to the beach. Not that she deserved for any harm to come to her - but this was not exactly a random event! However, I am dismayed that the guys who were killed on STT get so little press, while the Aruba girl is still all over the papers and on CNN. Perhaps it's becasue she's "missing" and nobody knows what happened - thus, technically, she COULD still be alive somewhere.

Anyway, your point is well taken. Didn't one of the major newspapers do an article on this recently - how we focus on white female victims of crime at a much higher level of intensity than any others?

I think someone here mentioned that one of these young men had a name that was a common name in the VI. However, later reports are that neither man has ever been to the VI before. There's really no point in speculating on this one - and I'm sorry to say I doubt this crime will ever be solved.

And shame on the 4th Estate for treating the two events with such different levels of coverage - and on the Govt of the VI's for breathing an audible sigh of relief when the press went away taking the pressure to solve the crime with it.

You can almost hear that sigh of relief in the article http://www.virginislandsdailynews.com/index.pl/article_home?id=6147427 Far more concerned with any possible impact on tourism than on the murder and absolutely nothing in todays VI Daily News on-line.

The girl should have not been doing what she was doing & neither should the men. Either way..no one deserves to die...and from what I have heard fromt the locals that I know who live there...word is..something fishy WAS going on.

It is true however about how the media handles things. Just like when that Elizabeth Smart girl was missing..there was a little black boy missing at the same time..with barely any coverage at all. Same thing with Jon Benet Ramsey...at the same time..there was a horrible story about a little girl in the Cabrini Green projects that had something to awful to speak of happen...and yet hardly anyone heard of her..makes ya wonder about the bias.

When I queried a retired Afican/American Judge from DC about the same thing, stating that 5000 people are missing every year in the US, why so much press. He told me she is carrying an International Passport. When I asked, what? He pointed to a white piece of paper. That's all he had to do. Sad social commentary huh?

RL

Here's a link to the Washington Post article abotu the bias...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/09/AR2005060901729.html

I'm hearing from a source that someone who has knowledge about the crime has been flown off-island for protection while the investigation continues.

This is not something I would pass on if I didn't trust the information's source.

RNK

I'm from the family of one of the young men shot in St. Thomas, and I have no idea what you're talking about re: "The 'Today' show interviewed the parents" since neither of the men's parents were on "Today." Their surnames were Haitian and Guyanese but one was born in NYC, the other moved to NYC as a young child, both were raised in NYC and this was their first trip to any of the islands.

Thank you to those of you expressing sympathy for our families and for talking about this crime. Neither family has the resources that the girl missing in Aruba's family has and it has been very difficult to keep this case in the public consciousness - and without the publicity and consciousness, we are afraid that this too will be shunted off to the "unsolved cases" room in the basement of the USVI police headquarters.

On NBC, out of New York, on the 'Today' show, there was a news spot regarding the incident, and SOMEONE was interviewed and it was reported that they were the parents of one of the victims. I realize what a tragedy this is for everyone involved, but don't bite my head off. I didn't put them on the 'Today' show...I just watched it.

Regarding their surnames: Those surnames are also found here. My last name is 'Fredericks', and it, too is found here...even though it is German. To say that 'Fredericks' is of local origin is correct...Just not my family line. Seems to be the case with these gentlemen, aslo.

Hoping for a quick resolution,

I'm touchy about the Today Show because honestly, we have been very disappointed with the lack of national media attention to the story - only NYC covered this until CNN did a story Friday night. (Anderson cooper show, transcript at http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0506/24/acd.01.html, the most accurate depiction of my relative so far.) The only interview that was aired that early in this situation was NYC's local affiliate who interviewed cousins of one of the young men; perhaps it aired during the local news portion of Today, but it was not broadcast nationally to anyone's knowledge here.

Sorry if you took my post as biting your head off, but as I read the posts here, I read several assumptions and hypotheses regarding the young men that had me a bit steamed this morning. It's almost funny to read about "$100,000" and large quantities of drugs in reference to these particular young men, but it points to people's automatic assumptions regarding crime and race and age and gender... Even the NYC press felt the need to point out the boys had "no criminal record," as if it was odd for two Black young men in Queens to not have a history of problems with the law. The Washington Post article someone linked to was very good in pointing out some of that.

Sorry to ramble and thanks for your good wishes.

Your family has my heartfelt sympathy. To me it is outrageous that there has been no mention of this terrible crime in the VI Daily News (on-line) since last Thursday and that the mainstream media have ignored it almost completely.

We just got back from St John on Tuesday. Because of an early flight, we came to St Thomas for Monday night, staying at the Holiday Inn. The hotel staff gave us directions to the resturants a few blocks down which we walked to. On the way I noticed plastic flowers hanging in the bushes near a bus stop, and the next morning the cab driver confirmed that this was where the 2 young men had been killed.

Someone on the Island would not know what parts of town are bad. In fact, the Holiday Inn did not appear to be in a bad part of town when we reserved a room over the Internet. The resturant area did appear to be 'struggling' in a tough neighborhood, and the walk back to the hotel after dark made my 'street senses' go on the alert.

We were a family with 2 children about 12 years old. How would a tourist know to avoid that area...they would not.